The Liberal Lie, The Conservative Truth

Exposing the Liberal Lie through current events and history. “Republicans believe every day is the Fourth of July, but the democrats believe every day is April 15.” ****** "We will always remember. We will always be proud. We will always be prepared, so we may always be free." RONALD REAGAN

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HISTORICAL QUOTE OF THE WEEK - "Always bear in mind that your own resolution to succeed is more important than any other." ABRAHAM LINCOLN

Monday, March 16, 2009

BARACK OBAMA MAKING VETS PAY FOR MEDICAL SERVICE IF WOUNDED OR DISABLED

Yes you read the title correctly. Barack Obama, in order to raise and estimated $540 million dollars to help pay for his socialist agenda is changing the way that wounded soldiers who have been injured or disabled are charged for Veterans Services.

Instead of continuing the honorable system of caring for disabled and wounded veterans through VA benefits, Obama is pushing through a plan that will require wounded and disabled vets to use private insurance to reimburse the VA for expenses related to their disability or injuries. So according to Barack Obama, a soldier who is wounded in battle and becomes disabled or injured because of that wound no longer is to be taken care of by the country who asked this brave American to sacrifice in service for our country.

What happened to the time honored idea that ANYONE who serves this nation and because of that service is wounded, injured and/or disabled because of that service DESERVES to be taken care of out of a profound gratitude for the sacrifice and service in the defense of this country ?

Obviously Obama could care less about our military and the brave men and women whose sacrifice made it possible for someone like him to become President. This is the lowest and most despicable move made by any President and personally I consider this action a crime against the brave men and women who serve this country through their military service.

Commander David K. Rehbein of The American Legion met personally with Obama concerning this despicable plan and stated that Obama refused to listen to his arguments about the moral and government avowed obligations to veterans that this plan would compromise. In fact the only reason Obama met with Commander Rehbein was to try and solicit the SUPPORT of the American Legion for this disgusting plan. Support that the Commander stated Obama will NEVER receive.

What's next an across the board pay cut for military personnel in order to pay for Obama's nationalizing of health care ? Or maybe he will charge military personnel for the use of military aircraft to arrive at their post when sent to battle, in order to pay for Nancy Pelosi's use of military aircraft for she and her cronies to party in San Francisco.

In a letter of protest against the plan Commander Rehbein stated, " There is simply no logical explanation for billing a veteran's personal insurance for care that the VA has a responsibility to provide. While we understand the fiscal difficulties this country faces right now, placing the burden of those fiscal problems on the men and women who have already sacrificed a great deal for this country is unconscionable."

Is Obama as Commander in Chief, (I gag each time I think of this guy as CIC), willing to give up his government medical coverage to help raise money for his socialist agenda ? Of course not. This one move alone especially coming from the CIC shows how little respect and in fact an actual disdain that Obama has for those who are willing to sacrifice for this country.

As Commander in Chief he is responsible for the care and actions of the military and to neglect our veterans in this despicable way is a crime against the brave American heroes who fall under the command of the CIC. Personally I see this as a high crime and misdemeanor and as such an impeachable offense. A field commander who would sacrifice the well being of his troops would face a courts marshal for this type of offense and so should Obama then removed from office!

Ken Taylor

39 Comments:

Blogger MDConservative said...

You just have to love it!!!

Last month when I wrote in disbelief regarding missile defense cuts and the "stimulus" bill I put together some of my favorite spending. Forget defending the nation, forget taking care of those who defended it!

We have REAL THINGS to spend our money on:

Farming Broadband grants to rural communities
$2 BILLION

Food 13% increase in food stamp payments
$20 BILLION

Commerce Grants to provide wireless and broadband infrastructure to communities, including public computer centers and sustainable adoption of broadband service
$4.3 BILLION

Justice Grants to state and local law enforcement to hire extra police officers
$1 BILLION

Science National Science Foundation research
$2.5 BILLION

Environment Flood control and water management construction, regulation and investigations
$4.1 BILLION

Energy Home weatherization grants to low and middle-income families
$5 BILLION

Energy Advanced batteries manufacturing grants
$2 BILLION

Energy Research and development of renewable and efficient energy technology
$2.5 BILLION

Energy Fossil energy research and development
$1 BILLION

Energy Grants for industrial carbon capture and energy efficiency improvement projects
$1 BILLION

Energy Physics research including high-energy physics, nuclear physics and fusion energy sciences
$1.6 BILLION

Energy Money for federal power marketing administrations in electric power transmission systems
$6.5 BILLION

Environment & Energy $50.8 BILLION

Government Construction, repair and energy alterations to federal buildings and facilities
$5.5 BILLION

Labor Grants to states for youth training, including summer jobs
$1.2 BILLION

Labor Grants to states for dislocated worker employment and training activities
$1.3 BILLION

Health and services National Institutes of Health biomedical research
$9.5 BILLION

Health and services Funding for research comparing effectiveness of treatments funded by Medicare, Medicaid and SCHIP
$1.1 BILLION

Health and services Grants to states for childcare services for low-income working parents
$2 BILLION

Transportation Grants for airport improvements
$1,100

Transportation Grants for capital investments in designated high-speed rail corridors
$8 BILLION

Housing Repairs and modernization of public housing projects
$4 BILLION

Housing Energy efficiency retrogrades to low-income housing, including new insulation, windows and furnaces
$2.3 BILLION

Individual aid Two-year extension of program providing income support and training benefits for workers who lose their jobs because of outsourcing overseas
$1.6 BILLION

1:46 AM, March 17, 2009  
Blogger Rob said...

Ken, I don't understand your concern.

If you don't like the plan, are you stating that vets should never be allowed to get private insurance? They should always remain in VA care?

I thought you were against socialized medicine. What do you think VA care is? You don't want vets to have a choice?

If a vet remains in VA care they are fully covered - there is no change or reduction in VA spending. In fact, Obama and the Democratic Congress have closed the funding shortfalls that Bush left the VA. His proposed 2010 budget includes a 15 percent increase in the VA budget - the largest increase in history.

If a vet wants to get private insurance, he/she can still do so. However, an insurance company cannot deny service and send the vet back to the VA if they don't want to cover a procedure. Right now, private insurance companies take vets' money for premiums and then deny coverage and tell vets to go to a VA hospital when they feel a medical procedure is too expensive. It is completely unfair to vets. The insurance firms collect their premiums but they don't provide the service. The Obama proposal would eliminate that. Private insurers could not play this kind of shell game with vet care.

9:27 AM, March 17, 2009  
Blogger The Liberal Lie The Conservative Truth said...

Rob, this is a non-defensable argument. And don't give me this sociaized medicine crap. VA care for someone who has served this nation is not socialized medicine it is aobligation owed for service in scarifice to our country. There is a HUGE diofference between socialized medicine and caring for VETS who have scrificed especially if wounds cause disability etc.

Requiring that private insurance reimburse the VA for medical treatment especially if that treatment is because of wounds or disabilities because of wounds is dispicable....period.

As a nation we owe these brave men and women more than we can ever repay and requiring individual insurance to reimburse disgust me. Even if you want to go there what about the deductables, or the copays, or the 20 or 39 % that is required from most private insurance. If this disgusting plan goes through then wil a VET who has been wounded have to pay 30% in order to satisfy Obama's whim ?

Again Rob this is non-defensable and there is no excuse for it nor should it be allowed to pass. Hopefully Congressional members will have more understand and compassion for our beat abd bravest than their obviously non-caring CIC!

9:55 AM, March 17, 2009  
Blogger The Liberal Lie The Conservative Truth said...

Oh BTW Rob, I never suggested that VETS not be allowed to get private insurance. What I am disgusted about is that a service we owe them because of what they did for this country has become an Obama polictical game.

If a VET chooses to opt out of VA care than that is his free choice. But that still does NOT change our obligation as a nation to care for their treatment etc. Again this is not socialized medicine it is a moral obligation for those who have sacrificed for this country. Period!

10:25 AM, March 17, 2009  
Blogger Rob said...

I don't think you read my response, and by your response I don't think you understand the issue.

No vet will ever have to pay for care at the VA. If they remain in VA care, their medical bills are fully covered. I have no idea why you think vets will now have to pay for VA care. There is no proposal to change how VA care works. And once again, Obama has fully funded the VA with a record increase in its budget.

VA care is government run health care - it is not private insurance or private hospitals so it is "socialized medicine."

The proposed change is simply if a vet decides to leave VA care and get private insurance. The proposal that Obama is offering prevents insurance companies from taking premiums from vets and then screwing them and the American taxpayers by denying coverage and sending them back to VA care without penalty.

This is a market-based solution to insurance fraud that is HAPPENING RIGHT NOW. I just don't understand what your objection is.

10:33 AM, March 17, 2009  
Blogger Mike's America said...

I see Rob is up to his usual low standard for obfuscating an issue.

Obama is trying to SCREW injured Vets.

End of story.

Either that or Rob doesn't believe the American Legion has a legitimate concern.

11:26 AM, March 17, 2009  
Blogger The Liberal Lie The Conservative Truth said...

Rob, it is you who does not understand. The plan Obama is pushing and tried to solicit the support of the American Legion which did not happen, REQUIRES that private insurance REIMBURSE the VA for the care of a wounded or disabled soldier.

Even some in his own party are troubled by this plan and will fight its passage.

This is not an opt out program but will REQUIRE private insurance to reimburse for VA care.

Again Rob, caring for VETS medical and socialized medicine are not on the same page. Yes VA is a government health in the respect that is is funded by the government. But that does not mean socializing in the same sense as nationalized helath care.

Taking care of VETS is a moral obligation because of sacrificed service for our country. Nationalized medicine is forcing people to recive government sponsored health care and allowing government to control that same health care.

There is a world of difference between moral obligation in garditude for service and health care sponsored by, run by and controlled by the government.

11:27 AM, March 17, 2009  
Blogger The Liberal Lie The Conservative Truth said...

Mike, you are right on the mark. Rob is defending the indefensable!

11:28 AM, March 17, 2009  
Blogger The Liberal Lie The Conservative Truth said...

Rob, here is a link from about the Commander of the American Legion who met with Obama and was angered by the meeting and stated what he was told by Obama during the meeting!

http://news.yahoo.com/s/usnw/20090316/pl_usnw/the_american_legion_strongly_opposed_to_president_s_plan_to_charge_wounded_heroes_for_treatment

11:30 AM, March 17, 2009  
Blogger The Liberal Lie The Conservative Truth said...

Rob, the link I posted above will not take for some reason so here is the link to the Drudge Report (http://drudgereport.com/ )and then click on the Drudge link titled, "American Legion Commander deeply dissappointed, concerned after meeting with Obama"

11:33 AM, March 17, 2009  
Blogger Rob said...

I've said my piece - this is to prevent INSURANCE FRAUD THAT IS CURRENTLY OCCURING AT THE EXPENSE OF OUR VETS.

Here is the bottom line: If you are a vet and you are in VA care there is no change for you. In fact, Obama is proposing a 15% increase in VA funding which is a record increase in funding.

If you are a private health insurance company that is taking money from vets in premiums. You cannot keep the money and then deny service and ship vets that you are covering back to the VA so taxpayers pick up the bill (AKA, insurance fraud).

12:11 PM, March 17, 2009  
Blogger Gayle said...

You're absolutely right, Ken. Rob is debating an issue he obviously doesn't understand.

My blogging partner, a veteran, has also written a post about this. As a veteran he's extremely angry and he has every right to be. I hope Rob will take the time to read it. The title alone may give you an idea as to just how angry he is:

Screw You, Mister President!

3:47 PM, March 17, 2009  
Blogger Rob said...

Gayle, I read the post. So? All it tells me is that Old Soldier doesn't actually understand what the policy proposal is for.

For the umpteenth time there is no change in VA care. If you stay on VA care you are fully covered just as you are now (although a record increase in money will finally go to adequately fund VA care).

There are private health insurance cmopanies that are targeting vets for private health coverage. They sign them up, tax vets' money, but then, when they have to actually pay medical bills for these vets they reject the claims. They are then telling vets to go back to the VA hospitals for care.

So vets are paying their health insurance premiums to private companies who are all to happy to take the money, but they are not providing care. They are keeping the money but then sending the vets back into the VA system. THIS IS INSURANCE FRAUD!

You are not protecting vets if you are complaining about this particular policy proposal. You are supporting the current system which allows private health insurance companies to make money and still send vets who paid for coverage back into the VA system on taxpayer expense.

Look, for anyone who cannot understand the very simple principles behind Obama's policy - that it helps vets and American taxpayers - you need to do a little reading. But rest assured that you are being duped into protecting unscrupulous private health insurance practices that are fleecing our vets and every taxpayer in this nation.

4:13 PM, March 17, 2009  
Blogger Rob said...

Let me ask a very simple question,

If a vet has private health insurance, should that insurance company deny him/her health care that he/she has rightfully paid for?

If your answer is "yes," then you are for the current system that is allowing firms to do this without any penalty.

If your answer is "no," as I believe, then you believe that private health insurance companies that are charging vets for coverage and that are profiting (quite handsomely I might add) by denying vet claims and dumping our veterans back into the taxpayer-financed VA system should be required to pay for it.

If you believe in the former and not the latter, then you are essentially for insurance fraud that you are willing to pay for with your taxes. It is that simple.

4:22 PM, March 17, 2009  
Blogger The Liberal Lie The Conservative Truth said...

Rob, this is my last comment on this. The key to this whole dispicable plan is that it does not ,"stop fraud." But it will REQUIRE Vets whether active duty or not to have private health care and that private health care will be REQUIRED to REIMBURSE the VA for all medical treatment for all Vets.

Other than the dispicable act of REQUIRING Vets to use private coverage to pay back the VA for mediacl treatment that we owe them for their service. Many wounded soldiers have such catasrophic wounds that the cost to a private insurere will cause the rates for all within that insurer to rise because of the cost. A cost that morally and righfully should be 100% covered by a grateful nation and not private insurance.

Also as mentioned before a private insurance will also have a deductablt to meet, a copay of 15 to 30 % depending on the insurance all of which comes oyt of the pocket of the Vet and his/her family which is not the case with VA benefits.

Obama's plan will REQUIRE the private insurance reimbursement.

11:42 PM, March 17, 2009  
Blogger Rob said...

It does not REQUIRE vets to seek out private insurance - there is no such requirement. I don't know where you came up with that.

The reality is that Obama proposing a record 15 percent increase in VA funding. Vets have full VA coverage for life just as they do now.

If vets choose to get private insurance and pay for private health coverage, then all this proposal does is ensures that insurance companies live up to their obligations. Right now, some insurance companies are taking premiums, earning profits from our vets, and then failing to meet their coverage obligations.

The ONLY insurance companies that will have to reimburse the VA are those that take vets' premium payments for private insurance, deny coverage, and send them back to the VA so taxpayers can pick up the bill. They are doing this to avoid their obligation to our vets and to make money.

You are advocating for continuing to allow insurance fraud. The Obama proposal would do right by our vets and all taxpayers and squeeze out unscrupulous practices by some insurance firms using a very simple market approach.

If you don't believe me that is fine, but you should at least understand what is happening. Otherwise you are just spreading along misinformation to our vets and families of vets.

12:05 AM, March 18, 2009  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

http://news.yahoo.com/s/usnw/20090316/pl_usnw/the_american_legion_strongly_opposed_to_president_s_plan_to_charge_wounded_heroes_for_treatment

"Commander Rehbein reiterated points made last week in testimony to both House and Senate Veterans' Affairs Committees. It was stated then that The American Legion believes that the reimbursement plan would be inconsistent with the mandate that VA treat service-connected injuries and disabilities given that the United States government sends members of the armed forces into harm's way, and not private insurance companies. The proposed requirement for these companies to reimburse the VA would not only be unfair, says the Legion, but would have an adverse impact on service-connected disabled veterans and their families. The Legion argues that, depending on the severity of the medical conditions involved, maximum insurance coverage limits could be reached through treatment of the veteran's condition alone. That would leave the rest of the family without health care benefits. The Legion also points out that many health insurance companies require deductibles to be paid before any benefits are covered. Additionally, the Legion is concerned that private insurance premiums would be elevated to cover service-connected disabled veterans and their families, especially if the veterans are self-employed or employed in small businesses unable to negotiate more favorable across-the-board insurance policy pricing. The American Legion also believes that some employers, especially small businesses, would be reluctant to hire veterans with service-connected disabilities due to the negative impact their employment might have on obtaining and financing company health care benefits."

That's just an excerpt ...try reading the rest and get a clue of how devastating this would be for everyone.

2:20 AM, March 18, 2009  
Anonymous Old Soldier said...

Rob, I’m afraid you are the one who has swallowed the Kool-Aid on this issue. As ‘Anonymous’ brought to the forefront via the quote, the ‘plan’ President Obama proposes will eventually require vets and active duty personnel to buy third party health insurance which will be required to reimburse the military or VA health care systems. That, my friend, is where the president’s ‘savings’ will come from – reimbursement back to the government that will go to the Treasury, not the healthcare provider or even the service/agency, but into the Treasury for redirection to ‘other’ programs, like Socialized healthcare for the crack-head down the street.

In reality, vets do not buy third party healthcare insurance to cover treatment of service-connected injuries/ailments for which they receive treatment at VA facilities. It would make no sense. Vets buy supplemental insurance to cover copays and or conditions/ailments that are not service-connected. Vets ‘duped’ by insurance companies most likely do not understand their coverage or may mistakenly try to seek reimbursement for something not covered. I’ve seen that quite a bit in some of our very senior (old) vets.

Regarding your classifying healthcare for service members and vets as ‘socialized medicine…’ it appears your foundational element is that the healthcare is provided by the government, therefore it is a social program. Would you consider a Mobile Army Surgical Hospital (yes, MASH) on the battlefield to be a social program? How about the forward deployed medics in each unit who provide immediate life sustaining treatment; would they be government social workers? There is a significant difference between providing an unearned service to a crack-head in the projects and supporting/sustaining those called to bear arms in defense of the nation. Free medical care for the crack-head because he/she cannot qualify for insurance coverage is socialized medicine… free medical care for service members and vets is a moral and ethical obligation for the government. Tampering with it to fund programs for those who have not earned the service provided is Socialism, ...and that is what President Obama is all about.

7:48 AM, March 18, 2009  
Blogger Rob said...

I've explained why the Obama Administration is discussing the issue. Our understanding of "the plan" differ greatly.

Since there is no actual plan on the table, or that has been formally proposed, we'll see what the details are when it comes out.

9:54 AM, March 18, 2009  
Blogger The Liberal Lie The Conservative Truth said...

Rob, the following quotes come from the horses mouth abotu the plan that you say does not exists and that is only to prevent fraud!

"WASHINGTON (CNN) -- Veterans Affairs Secretary Eric Shinseki confirmed Tuesday that the Obama administration is considering a controversial plan to make veterans pay for treatment of service-related injuries with private insurance."

"The Administration included in its 2010 budget proposal an increase in "third-party collections" at VA health care centers. Veterans groups say that the only way the govenment can realize that projected revenue is to begin charging veterans for service-related injuries."

The plan is included as part of the projected revenue in the 2010 budget. So this is not just immaginary or Obama trying to help Vets. It is a dispicable act trying to force Vets to pay for service related injuries through private health care...period!

10:55 AM, March 18, 2009  
Anonymous Old Soldier said...

Rob, it seems your explanation differs from the administration's; perhaps you should confer with the WH and get them back on track...

1:48 PM, March 18, 2009  
Blogger Rob said...

There is nothing in those quotes that disputes anything I have said or the plan that is being talked about. Increasing "third party" collections means collecting from health insurers of vets who are not living up to their current obligations.

If a vet has private health insurance that they are paying for, that insurance company is responsible for paying their health related expenses.

I assume you agree with this. Otherwise, what else is the vet paying for?

So, if the insurance company fails to live up to its obligation and sends the vet back to the VA so he/she can get treatment, all the plan does is require the insurance company to pay up. Right now, they aren't paying. In fact, there is a strong financial incentive for them to deny care and have the VA pick up the slack.

If they don't pay up, then they are taking vets' money, not delivering an actual service, requiring the vet to go back to the VA to get treated, and sticking the bill to taxpayers.

THAT IS SIMPLE INSURANCE FRAUD.

When the actual plan comes out, if it states that veterans will be required to go out and get private health insurance, that VA care will no longer be available, and that vets will now be charged for services, then I will join you in condemning such a plan.

However, I can assure you that that is not the plan. The fact is that Obama is proposing a 15% increase to VA funding for 2010 (the VA and vets groups pushed for an 8% increase), and has laid out a budget blueprint to increase VA funding by a record $25 billion over the next three years.

2:25 PM, March 18, 2009  
Blogger The Liberal Lie The Conservative Truth said...

Rob, did you read the quote from the VA Sec ? The plan that is on the table would REQUIRE private insurance to take up the cost of service related injuries.

This has nothin to do with whether a VET can use or does use private insurance, that is their oprtion if they so choose. The problem is that private insurance will be required to pay for SERVICE related injuries.

Not just a routine visit to the doctor or flu shots etc, but service rleated injuries. Under Obama's plan if a soldier is wounded in Afghanistan a private insurance plan will be required to take up the cost of his sevice related care not the VA and that is the moral obligation and the disgusting action that Obama is setting aside in order to raise revenues for nationalized health care.

Those who met with Obama stated that this is his plan, the VA Sec. stated that this is the plan who else do you want to hear from ?

Fact the plan is not to prevent fraud but to shift the responsibility of caring for wounded soldiers from the VA, which is our moral obligation to our service men and women who have been wounded, to private insurance with all of the ramifications of deductables, copays and dollr ceilings that any catastrophic care do for war wounds would likely reach.

Leaving no insurance coverage for other problems that might happen in a calendar year for the VET or his family.

They deserve complete care when inured in the line of duty and NOT passing the buck to Blue Cross, Blue Shield!

3:45 PM, March 18, 2009  
Blogger The Liberal Lie The Conservative Truth said...

BTW Rob, Obama refused to even listen to ANY of the moral arguments that the 11 groups who met with him brought up, similar to what I stated in the above comment.

He told them they had 72 hours to come up with another plan and if not he was sending his plan to Congress. This can be found anywhere on the web.

3:48 PM, March 18, 2009  
Blogger Gayle said...

It's not only an abuse of money, it's an abuse of the American people!

Ken, I absolutely love the video you posted up top, and when I get time I will post it with a hat tip to you. Great job!

I have to go plant tomatoes now, but wanted to see what you were doing. I'm glad I took the time to do that. :)

4:58 PM, March 18, 2009  
Blogger Rob said...

Yeah, I read it. If you are a vet that is paying for private health care and the insurance company denies your medical claim and sends you to the VA, they will be required to pay the VA back. So?

We disagree on our understanding of Obama's plan.

I have agreed that if you are right and Obama actually proposes eliminating VA coverage, making private insurers pick up the tab, and forcing vets to pay for it he would be absolutely wrong.

I assume that you agree that Obama proposed increasing VA funding by a record 15% for 2010 in his budget and that he is going to increase VA funding by 25% (i.e., $25 billion) over the next three years. So that seems to be at odds with your argument.

If I am correct, and the Obama plan is an effort to stop insurance companies from taking advantage of vets and taxpayers, and that it is to eliminate insurance fraud, I assume you will admit you are mistaken.

Let's see what the details of the plan actually are when it is proposed.

5:01 PM, March 18, 2009  
Blogger Rivka said...

Sheesh, I ditto what Mike said. It is evident Rob isn't into thinking through this issue. The blinders are on.

6:35 PM, March 18, 2009  
Blogger Rivka said...

Oh yeah and today the White House dropped this plan! ;0) I guess all the outrage from the vets kind of got to them, but according to Rob the Vets really just kind of pulled all of this out of thin air and had nothing to be upset about.

6:37 PM, March 18, 2009  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Dear Rivka - pls dont get all sweaty about this. Our dear president would NEVER mistreat the vets. AND PLEASE REMEMBER who put us firmly in place for WAR BY CHOICE. GET REAL.

9:41 PM, June 12, 2009  
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